Prepare to be captivated as we sit down with Kurt Bonner, the real estate guru with a healing touch, who transitioned from physical therapy to mastering the world of property investment. Our chat with Kurt is not just a story of career transformation, but a treasure trove of wisdom for anyone looking to forge their own path in real estate. He gives us the lowdown on the importance of a solid 'why', the commitment needed to succeed, and how a good book can spark a revolution in your investment strategy. Explore the depths of his knowledge as he reveals how his medical background intermingles with his passion for property management.
Strap in for an episode that unpacks the essential elements that make or break your real estate ventures. We delve into the art of creating a culture of goodwill, the power of robust systems, and the magic of a reliable team. With Kurt's expertise, we navigate the latest trends and opportunities in the Indianapolis market, emphasizing the need for diversification in your investment portfolio. From Airbnb to co-living, we dissect the intricacies of each rental strategy and how to stay agile in an ever-changing industry landscape, ensuring that your investments aren't just surviving, but thriving.
Crowning the episode, we share invaluable investing tips and discuss the importance of community and connections in the realm of real estate. Kurt imparts strategies that have propelled his success, advocating for the power of partnerships and the impact of consistent, small actions. Additionally, we explore how real estate isn't just about the properties—it's about the people and the relationships you build along the way. Prepare to be inspired and equipped with the know-how to elevate your property management game, as we journey through the indispensable lessons Kurt Bonner has to offer.
Prepare to be captivated as we sit down with Kurt Bonner, the real estate guru with a healing touch, who transitioned from physical therapy to mastering the world of property investment. Our chat with Kurt is not just a story of career transformation, but a treasure trove of wisdom for anyone looking to forge their own path in real estate. He gives us the lowdown on the importance of a solid 'why', the commitment needed to succeed, and how a good book can spark a revolution in your investment strategy. Explore the depths of his knowledge as he reveals how his medical background intermingles with his passion for property management.
Strap in for an episode that unpacks the essential elements that make or break your real estate ventures. We delve into the art of creating a culture of goodwill, the power of robust systems, and the magic of a reliable team. With Kurt's expertise, we navigate the latest trends and opportunities in the Indianapolis market, emphasizing the need for diversification in your investment portfolio. From Airbnb to co-living, we dissect the intricacies of each rental strategy and how to stay agile in an ever-changing industry landscape, ensuring that your investments aren't just surviving, but thriving.
Crowning the episode, we share invaluable investing tips and discuss the importance of community and connections in the realm of real estate. Kurt imparts strategies that have propelled his success, advocating for the power of partnerships and the impact of consistent, small actions. Additionally, we explore how real estate isn't just about the properties—it's about the people and the relationships you build along the way. Prepare to be inspired and equipped with the know-how to elevate your property management game, as we journey through the indispensable lessons Kurt Bonner has to offer.
Welcome to Do the Talk podcast. It is your real estate podcast that teaches regular people how to invest in real estate. If you would like to learn and grow with us, you have come to the right place. Before I let's be saying this real estate it is not get rich quick scheme. You have to put in the work and, believe me, things will fall in line. Just keep watching, do the Talk and this will work out. My name is Ibrahim, I am your host and my co-host tonight is Ahmed Lawau. Today we have a special edition, ahmed. How are you doing today?
Speaker 2:Hi Ibrahim, it's been a great day so far, but I'm very happy because today we have a very great guest with us. He's gonna be effing us throughout the podcast today and, if you are watching right now, thank you for joining us. First of all, you want to stay care, and because we only have a few days into 2024 and a lot of what we're gonna be discussing is gonna be tying into what you think real estate market will look like. So if you're looking to jump into real estate, you want to take your pen and paper and glue to your screen to the hand so that you can learn all the way to the hand.
Speaker 2:But without further delay, the guest that we have today is someone that is very interesting individual, in my opinion, one that's very knowledgeable and do something different, even from real estate. So this is a person that is a personal trainer and the owner of IROC physical therapy. He is the owner of a TC home. He is an entrepreneur generally, he invests here in Indiana, in Kentucky. He is an all-round man. So the person I'm talking about is Kurt. How are you doing, kurt? Hey, everybody.
Speaker 3:Nice to meet you. Hey, kurt, how's it going?
Speaker 2:Good Welcome.
Speaker 3:Glad to be here, excited. Thanks for asking me to come in and hang out with you guys for a little bit.
Speaker 2:Thank you sir, hey Kurt. My first question would be who is Kurt Bonner?
Speaker 3:So I was give the fun speech first Definitely a husband and a father first, and then the part that everybody always expects after that is a real estate investor, the third part for me I am also a business owner for a physical therapy clinic For physical therapy and personal training and massage, and so that is kind of my nine to five, if you will, and then, as I say, pt by day, real estate investor by night, and then so I've been running that clinic for about this specific one for about six months, really progressing that forward, and we're over in Avon, indiana, so really familiar with the market over here, and then again, just as we all know, fall in love more and more with that indie market every day.
Speaker 2:Great, absolutely, absolutely great. So you mentioned the physical therapy cards and for our audience they will be like how does that tie into real estate? So can you kind of bring us back a little bit to what entices you, and when do you even start to realize its invest?
Speaker 3:I actually started about three and a half years ago. I had graduated from PT school a few years prior to that and I was just working kind of the nine to five and I realized like I love what I do as a physical therapist but I felt like there was more out there and everybody I knew that was doing really well for themselves owned real estate. The book that everybody always ends up talking about is Rich Dad, Poor Dad, and sure enough I found that bad boy and I read it in a day, and again that changed a lot of my perception in general. From there I went down a rabbit hole and started chasing after anything that I could get my hands on, just to learn more and more. So I read Avery Carl's short term stay, long term wealth. I read the 30 day stay book for medium term rentals, you name it. And then there's a couple other books that I'm really passionate about, with stuff why by Simon Sinek. I think those are books that a lot of times get overlooked.
Speaker 3:But you think about what real estate is. A lot of people kind of as you said earlier, Ibram, a lot of people kind of like, oh man, I want to make money really quick, right and real estate is not that way. You can make really good money in real estate, but you got to set up systems, you got to really decide what it's going to be like and when you have those terrible days and everything goes wrong which I can tell a story about that here a little bit, If you guys want me to you got to be able to say what your why is and why you're passionate about what your purpose is going forward. Because if you can't, man real estate is really tough. You have to grind. And again, people are always like, yeah, I just want that passive income and unfortunately that's not necessarily how it works. There are ways that you can do that and I can kind of explain how we help people do that later on as well. But for the most part, if you want to get into real estate and really learn what it is and what people are doing and why people actually get more and more passionate about it, you got to be ready to grind, and that's just how it is. So I read a few books and I did.
Speaker 3:I listened to every podcast under the sun, fell in love with bigger pockets, listened to all of that stuff, Started following a guy by the name of Rob Abasolo, also known as Rob Built on YouTube and then I just got plugged in. So I'm with his crew and I am a host camper with Rob Abasolo. We focus kind of the short term rental game, but medium terms as well, and then kind of what progressed me into my next model, where I'm with my current business partner, is going into co-living. So we can talk about that a little bit later as well. But I started diving in a little bit.
Speaker 3:I got our first property a little over a year and a few months back and it was an A-frame Cabot in the Woods in Kentucky, and again I live in Indianapolis. I told myself that if I bought it from far away I wouldn't go do all the work myself, which was a good thing. It forced me to have to build systems so that everything was in place, that if something needed to get taken care of I didn't have to be there, and so that was really good. But I still self-manage, which is a really, really cool thing and I encourage it for a lot of people. It just takes a lot of work up front to set everything up appropriately. But I got into that and we've been going for over a year We've been doing really well, Like I said, learning every day. In that timeframe I partnered with several other people and kind of progressed and still growing and learning.
Speaker 1:Very interesting. That's very interesting. So my question, my fourth question for you is when you made the attempt to get the house in Kentucky, then it kind of pealed like do you have to move there and stay there? How can you get contractors out and you navigate in the Kentucky business and make sure your properties get occupied and maintenance and everything? Aren't you scared about somebody calling in the middle of the night from India and you got to go to Kentucky and stuff?
Speaker 3:That's a fantastic question because absolutely now I will say because I'm married and there was no way that my wife was about to move down to Kentucky. She was like we're staying in Indybud, so you better lock up and we better make this work. So that was motivation in itself. So the way it ended up working is and Rob Abasolo talks about this all the time is when you're investing away from where you're at, or even if you are doing it where you're at. So when I do properties in Indy, I do the exact same thing. I don't want to be working directly in the business unless it's management side, because that's what I'm good at, and that way I can do what we call the big money ticket items right, I can go find more properties. I can go talk to other investors right, that stuff is more valuable to me because that's what I'm really good at. And so I want to hire my what we refer to as the Airbnb Avengers. You want to have your number one.
Speaker 3:Your most important person on your team is your cleaner. I went through 10 of them and there was a lot of interviewing and I had a couple of them ghost me, so it was just a lot of feedback. And then again it was. We set it up to where we essentially claimed exactly how we wanted it, and then we wrote it out on a piece of paper. I'm a big fan of from a business side and again, this is where my physical therapy background comes in handy is setting up your systems. It's so important. So we set up the standard operating procedure for any of our cleaners, so when they walk in the property they know exactly what's expected and they have pictures to follow too, so they don't have to worry about like, oh well, maybe I do it. And again, if they do it a slightly different way, as long as those pictures look the same, that's okay, as long as the property is clean right and they do a good job right, because we and we get great feedback from our guests with that too.
Speaker 3:So the cleaners the number one person. They're your eyes and ears for everything, even when we have medium term rental folks in there. We essentially we have our cleaners go in. So our last one, he was there for almost three months and we had our cleaner just go in once a month and just check on the place, do a thorough cleaning, still take care of some stuff, replenish the coffee and some of the laundry detergent and that stuff, just to kind of help everything out. And she was able to clean, take care of some stuff, notify me that there were some issues that needed to be addressed. So then I was able to go to my next Avenger, which is my maintenance person. And again, those are the people that I'll say those are the main two you want to take care of, right, because the second one being your maintenance person something goes wrong in your property. You want to be able to have somebody call and, yes, I am not about to drive down to Kentucky to fix the toilet. The very first guest that I had stay at my property, larry, said that she sat on the toilet and then the ring broke. With the wax ring underneath the toilet. I mean, I was like everything was fine when we left it and then it was the very first guest. Again, I called the maintenance guy. Now, actually a really cool story behind this and this is super important for anybody that's investing, especially whether it's I mean honestly, it's anywhere, but especially when you're investing out of state or further away, when you are hiring your cleaners and your maintenance people, pest control, all of those folks. It is really, really, really important to make sure that you take care of them right.
Speaker 3:In my first property where I invested, it was during Christmas time and I sent them gift cards and said, hey, I know you haven't worked on our property yet, but we're so grateful and excited to do this journey with you. And literally that next week we had all kinds of issues and I'll tell you this again, it wasn't necessarily an expectation to be at the top of their list, but because they saw that we valued them already, without them having to do anything, we went to the top of their list when stuff went wrong and they jumped on it. Just for instance, we had during that polar vortex last year, there was a crew that came in and they turned on all the water full blast and they didn't know how to read, which was something I never expected to have to prepare for, I guess, as a host. But again, you learn, you live and you learn In turn. They ended up busting several pipes and then they flooded half of the cabin, so there was a ton of stuff. And again these were our second guests, the first guests. Again a toilet broke, so second guests, so it was right out the gate learning stuff.
Speaker 3:But my cleaner was so diligent that she went out there right away and was checking and she calls me immediately and goes hey, the house is flooded right now. And I'm like that's awesome. She was like we'll take everything off. So they shut the water lines off. And again she went above and beyond because then she started calling people and I called my maintenance guy right away. He was like yeah, I'll come out right away. He's like you're one of the 25 on my list right now, but I'll come out right now. And I truly believe that was because we noticed him and we took care of him and he did some work for us before that as well. That really helped that.
Speaker 3:And I had that conversation. I was like, hey, are you okay with me paying you a little bit? Got a deal when to come and fix stuff. I said you tell me what the price is and I'll pay it Right. And with that we built that relationship. And I think so many of us as real estate investors we get a little stingy sometimes and we're like, oh no, man, I don't want to spend that money. I can go do that myself, but at the end of the day, again, think about what goes on with what we do as investors. If you're doing other things, again, you're not going to get to the big ticket items. So that is the importance of making sure that we invest in those people to help us be able to grow it Again. Whether it's in your backyard or whether it's home and far away, it doesn't matter. You got to set those people up and that's how you run it.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. Thank you for sharing that experience with us. I always tell people don't give away the good things you do. We all know we are good people, but when people thank me, I always tell them oh, if you are my shoe, you do the same. That's to remind them that if I need your help, I want you to come through. So don't give your. So the love reciprocity is real. You are not doing it for them to repay you, but you still want people to, because you will need them at some point. When you are describing this in my head, I'm saying whoops, so can you really quick talk us through what was going through your mind and how can you be so calm, even knowing that big things like that is happening somewhere, that you currently I mean you can go there within two hours, but you can't leave every other thing behind and just drive down what was going through your mind.
Speaker 3:You know, honestly, for this particular property, again, I was actually glad that I was four hours away, because I know that if it was here, specifically in Indy, at that time when I first started investing, that I would have been freaking out. I would have been over there trying to figure out what to do, I would have been panicking and, I don't know, maybe that could have been the end of my real estate career and journey, right, because I would have been so frustrated. I think part of it was I had to trust the systems, right. I knew, going into this and again, I'd heard this so many times that at some point you just have to pull the trigger, right, as we get analysis, paralysis, so much right. And all of us sit there and we're running properties, we're like, well, this one's kind of nice, I like this, this looks pretty cool. You know, I think I could do that, but I don't know if I'm ready yet. Let me read one more book, let me listen to one more podcast, right. But sometimes what it takes is to actually get your hands dirty and figure it out.
Speaker 3:And again, I will say, my physical therapy background has helped with that tremendously, because being a PT, I mean, I have people coming in all the time and they're in pain and that's what we deal with. You were in nursing right, so you've seen that world where, when people are in pain, they're not in a great mood, they're right, they're hurting, and knowing that is there is always, always, always a way to solve anything that's thrown at us. It doesn't matter what happens, there's always an answer, right, and it kind of like what you were saying too, ahmed, is when we are being diligent and caring for other people and showing that we care, things tend to work out. I'm a firm believer in that. All right and again, I had done my due diligence with my cleaners and with my maintenance people and I knew they were a rockstar team and so I trusted that they were going to be able to handle the situation diligently. And guess what they absolutely did? They crushed it. They took care of the entire situation and pretty much just kept me updated as it went right and then, like they sent me the bills to things as it was needed and you know what, it was as smooth as it possibly could have gone for the entire situation. Were there definitely times where I was panicking a little bit, like, oh gosh, is this going to happen every week? Absolutely and definitely in those moments but again, I just kept reminding myself is these are the moments that define a real estate investor being able to get through this and move on to the next thing and saying, hey, let's keep going.
Speaker 3:You always hear, when you talk to real estate investors right, specifically the ones that are no longer in it Everybody always talks about that terrible experience they had. They're like oh, those tenants always just screwed up my stuff and I always had to do stuff. If you ever talk to them, I always ask I'm like okay, so how much did you make when you sell the property, right? And how much did that tenant pay down on your debt, right? Oh, how much did you save on taxes by owning that real estate, right?
Speaker 3:People forget that's a huge component of real estate. Like, you got to find the metrics that work best for you and I'm not a CPA, not an accountant, I'm not an attorney. There's my disclosure. But if you look at it from a tax benefit, right, you get so many benefits from owning a business. You get benefits from owning a real estate property. There's secondary benefits from owning a short term rental, like you name it. There's so many benefits. So, even if you break even, as long as you can maintain that and you're okay with that, there's still a lot of benefits that you actually gain with that and there's a lot of cool metrics.
Speaker 3:Again, I advise people to go speak with a CPA about this stuff, because we're running a business, so your home becomes an office. You can actually write stuff off in your home for your utilities as an office, and again, it's all legal right and that's how we want it to be. And again, not a CPA, but those are things that I've talked with my CPAs about about how to be diligent, about when I'm preparing and using that stuff for my benefit as well, to help do it the right way, and so I'm a firm believer in that stuff. And, again, knowing that when you set up your systems first, when you set up and pick the right team, you're always, always, always going to be taken care of in the back end and, unfortunately, things are going to happen. There are going to be days that are just absolutely terrible, and welcome to real estate is all I have to say to that.
Speaker 1:All right, thanks, kurt. Currently, the indie market the way you look at it I'm talking about the meet time and show time we all know the way Airbnb is going right now, the way PIN are and all that. There are some people, audience, I mean even our audience they would like to know is it still something they can jump into, airbnb, or can you advise our audience tonight?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think. I mean, everybody talks about the recession coming up. Is it going to happen? Is it not going to happen? I think the big thing to take note of if you follow the metrics from everything that's gone on. Anytime you're investing, think of it again. What is an investment? It is something that you're taking a risk on. I think that's really important for people to know. Can you put all your money in something and lose that money Absolutely? What state is that Now? Can you also structure your business and add systems I mentioned that word how many times now where you lock it down so that you can at least stabilize if, hypothetically, there is a recession? I think those are the biggest points that we have to think about Now.
Speaker 3:We are not in the same market that we were in 2021 or even 2018. 2018 was a booming market for the short-term world. Medium-term world was kind of starting to creep in a little bit. 2021, we closed out for 2020. A portion of the way Everybody was panicking like, oh, airbnb is done forever, it's never coming back. Then everybody was like I got stuck at home, I'm going and traveling everywhere. Then we had the craziest year from a short-term perspective that we've ever had. Now you got to look at that, people were like, well, I want to do that, because people were literally just throwing up their couch on Airbnb and making crazy money on it. That doesn't happen. That's gone. People that are wanting to just throw something up and it be okay, that's gone Again. If you want the easy route where you can just throw something, anything up and not put up the amount of time that work into it, that's not there anymore.
Speaker 3:I think the importance on design is super, super important right now because so many people are doing a great job of designing their places. A tip that we always talk about is getting professional photos. That is like the number one thing that you can do is get professional photos. If I go into a neighborhood and I'm seeing properties around me that don't have professional photos, I literally look at them and go, I can beat them. I can beat them, I can beat them Again, not as like a bragging right, but it's literally a low hanging fruit. People are interested. I think that's a great place to start is, if you already know you're going to do it, one make sure you have reserves. That way, if something happens, you can kind of work it out Again, I think then always have multiple exit strategies you can always have.
Speaker 3:If you're planning on short term rental, that's known as making the most amount of money. Number two would be your medium term rental you get maybe you're traveling professionals, maybe you have traveling nurses, corporate executives, maybe you're doing insurance claims, anything along those lines. Then the third one that most people will think of is long term rental. I'm a firm believer that any property that you run unless it's a very specific market for short term rentals only I truly believe that when you run your numbers, it should be able to run as a long term, because if it doesn't, if stuff doesn't work out well, then you're a bad spot. But if you always plan forward to have that potential now you're in a good spot because, hey, short term doesn't work out, you paid for the furnishings, that's all you lost. You didn't even lose that because now you can literally throw that out, throw that in storage, and then pull it back out when you're ready to give it a shot again. Then turn it into a long term rental and still do. Well, guess what? You're still getting debt pay down. You're still getting tax benefits. You're still getting a lot of the benefits my favorite model right now is co -living.
Speaker 3:It's kind of by the room model. Essentially, you run it very similar to a short term, medium term model where you sign like a three month lease and then you go week to week. There's a big company called Pad Split that does this. It's a really cool model because it's a nice hybrid. Here's the thing in every market and it's got to be a big, big, important one in this but in every market, prices are just keep going up. That tells you. In real estate. It's done that since. I mean, you look at the history of real estate and it's always gone up. There will be those little incremental moments where it's coming down, but it's always going back up. Things are only going to get more expensive. I love the co-living model for that reason because, again, my passion is to help as many people as possible.
Speaker 3:I want to get people in housing and I want them to enjoy while they're there. Part of my phrasing that I always like to say is we want to create a home to live in, not just a place to stay. When you do something along those lines, we want to create an atmosphere, an environment, an experience for these people. We're super passionate about that. Looking at all of those things together is you can protect yourself when you have multiple exit strategies. You have a plenty amount of money and reserves. Again, if you're really not sure, go talk to people who are doing it. I met both of you guys at our medium term rental meetup for Indy. By doing that again, here we are having this connection, having this talk and helping more people learn about real estate.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. Thank you, kopt, for all these little gems that you're dropping. I know our audience are very appreciative right now because you talk a lot. You've touched a lot of things right now. Honestly, I want to mention the past splits that you just mentioned. I've heard about them. I haven't looked into them. Really, can you walk us through how they walk?
Speaker 3:Yeah, so a past split is like your operating agency. It's an OTA, just like Airbnb, but it's specifically for the co-living model. Again, you can run these essentially on Airbnb. We all know we've heard the stuff that's going on in the short-term rental world Right now. When people think of short-term rental, who do they go to? They talk about Airbnb. Airbnb, again. Great for Airbnb, because they really set the standard of what that should look like. From our side, that makes it a little tough, because if Airbnb goes out of business, well, guess what? If you don't have your business set up right, well, what are you going to do? I'm a firm believer, too, in progressing your business to actually make it a business that doesn't rely on somebody else to be working, for your business to work. Again, I get that because of my PT business. I can't rely on certain doctors to make referrals to my clinic. I have to go and make stuff happen. Sometimes it works great, sometimes it doesn't work great at all. At the end of the day, I know for me, if I get somebody in my clinic, they're going to stay because they're going to have a great experience. I'm a firm believer in hospitality, so we want to keep that there.
Speaker 3:Co-living. That model is short-term rentals but we're getting people who are maybe making a little bit less. Think about Indy, how many markets we get. We're actually one of the biggest providers to Amazon warehouses. I don't know how many people know that, but Indy is a huge market for Amazon warehouses. Those people are making anywhere from like $15 to $25 an hour, which isn't bad money, but they can't go buy a $400,000 house that's in Indy right now. We're actually considered a cheap market. Some of those folks are like well, I'm either living at home or I'm splitting rent with somebody else. Anyways, the Co-living model, the way it works, is essentially you're going into the property, I'm renting it to an individual at a time and everybody has their own lease for the room.
Speaker 3:You want to do conversions of these properties? You don't have to. It just makes them a little bit more desirable. But you look at let's say, you have a four bedroom house, that you're looking at a four bedroom, two bath. The four bedroom, two bath house has enough space where you could add two more bedrooms. What we're going to do is we would look to potentially take out the living room. Maybe, if there's a dining room, we'd take that out and make those bedrooms. Now we can make that a six bedroom, two bath. The bathrooms become a shared space and the kitchen becomes a shared space. You rent by the room and again, it depends on the market, it depends on what kind of, and you furnish it. It's similar to the medium term, short term rental model. You don't have to, but it's a good option.
Speaker 3:I like it. That's how I want to do it. Again, I want it to be a great stay for anybody that's staying with me in a co-living room. I want them to have a great experience because I want them to stay long term and I want them to enjoy themselves while they're there. When we go into that model, the way it works then is I still have a cleaner coming in and cleaning those common areas on a regular basis. Every week, I may have a cleaner come in and clean up both the bathrooms and the kitchen. Then, as people are rotating in and out, so if I have somebody assigned for a three month lease, they go to week to week, if they perform months, and then they're like, hey, I'm moving to a different city, whatever, doesn't matter. They're like, hey, I'm out, they notify me and then I have that room cleaned and then I post it again to be vacant, for somebody else to come stay and do the same thing.
Speaker 3:What's cool about this model is you can make upwards. I'll say it ranges. I normally run numbers at $150 a room. That comes out to about $600 a month per room. I'm a physical therapist, so what you'll learn is I'm not good with math and I'm top-ranked. I guess that one's an easy one. That's $3,600. If you have six rooms rented out, that's the average rent. You think about that. $600 is really cheap for people, that's really affordable. But on our side, as the investors, we're getting people to come in, giving them a great experience and then we're making good money. On the other side, I don't know about you guys, but $3,600 would work for most places, wouldn't it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's more than now.
Speaker 3:Yeah, then you can take that model. Most people are actually staying a little bit longer than you.
Speaker 1:Well, he asked for one.
Speaker 3:You don't have as much turnover. You're just turning over one room at a time, which is also kind of nice. There's a lot of benefits to it. We're looking to just continue to grow that here in the indie market. I'm really excited about that.
Speaker 1:Absolutely, that's a good one. So I want to ask you this is very interesting to me In this kind of model, do you have to like get CDPARM to kind of like change your rooms and everything to add more rooms in the same house? That way when you're trying to sell it, you don't have to issue it?
Speaker 3:Oh, yeah, again, do your due diligence, always do it. Yeah, it depends on the city, but that's normally. The stuff that you want to start with is always checking and seeing what permits are needed. When we go to a property that we're interested in for this, we take a contractor with us that knows the place really well. Again, I'm a physical therapist. I'm good with working on the body, right. I'm not good at working on furniture and walls and stuff. You don't want me doing that because you'll end up with holes in them, right? I like I leave the professionals to their game there. Here's the thing if you get those right people, again, you're bringing them in. They can literally walk the house with you.
Speaker 3:Again, I'm a visionary and my business partner is also a visionary for this stuff. We're talking out like okay, we could put a room right here, we could put a room here. If we do a wall here, it's great, because the contractor's like nope, that's a violation, that's a code. We're like are you sure, can't we make this work? He's over here like, nope, nope, we're not doing that.
Speaker 3:And again, that's the importance of having those people on your team, right, because you want those permits to make sure that it satisfies everything going forward. Because, again, last thing you want to do is get into a property and then find out that you can't rent it out, right, spend all this money. And then all of a sudden you're like planning on making $3,600 a month. You're like, oh, I'm cooking, we're going out to folger date show tonight. And then all of a sudden you get a no rental notice or something on your door saying hey, or a call from the city saying hey. By the way, we're pressing a lawsuit against you, right? We don't want that stuff. So do your due diligence always. Reach out, get your permitting down appropriately, get a contractor in there that knows what they're talking about and make sure that they're a big part of that team, because that's so, so, so, stinking important.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, absolutely. So that's really cool. I've heard them for more than a year now. For some reason, I've been lazy about looking more into them and see how I can work with them, and this is a trend, right? I am a student of SOP2.
Speaker 2:So, I've seen these guys that home pass it, been on Zoom with them multiple times. But it's one thing about trend is if you can jump on it early, you're going to make a lot of money, and if you have established themselves on when here be and be and short time rent, passed up it back in the day. So in India, with mid-term rent in and short-term rent in, I'm bringing in co-living right now. What do you think 2024 is going to look like? Is it going to be a good year to invest for newbies, or is season investor going to be the one that will dominate? What do you think to 2024 would in the mid-term and middle-term? Yes.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think I'm always a big fan of it's never too late, it's never too early to invest. But again, you want to get in the right groups, right connections to people, because if you go in by yourself, you're just it's really hard one, it's lonely, it's not fun and again, when you don't know what you don't know, you're going to just put yourself in a really bad situation. And I can say that because I've done that and it's really important, especially, I think in 2024, it's going to be a really hard year. I think there's a lot of potential because it's going to be a hard year. So just because it's a hard year does not mean it's not going to be an awesome year. We have some pretty hefty goals that we're playing on hitting this year or well, this coming year, because there's a lot of opportunity out there. But it's because we're confident in our models and our systems that we've put in place to do what we're about to do.
Speaker 3:Again, people that are like nervous about investing maybe there's a better way for you to do it. Maybe it's investing with somebody that's already been invested, right? Maybe it's making cold calls for people, right? You talk about the sub two community. There's always a need to find more deals right, so we getting that stuff going creative findings, I mean I love it. My partner is a sub two student as well. She's a freaking rock star, but again, we're always trying to find ways to get more people involved and to do more things.
Speaker 3:2024 is going to be hard. If you again I said this earlier if you go on and throw up something just on Airbnb, it may do okay, but you're going to get beat out all right. And if there are any restrictions or regulations that change in Indy, which has been on the talk mode for a decent amount of times, you're going to get hit by that. And if you have a plan for medium term rental stuff, then you're going to get hit by that. Medium term rentals work best when you build relationships right, and we've had some other awesome folks who are doing a lot of medium term rentals, kind of join our Indy medium term rental meetup and with that they're going out there and they're cold calling you know all these insurance agencies and setting up different things with other groups and that's so, so, so sticking important, like I get opportunities with different deals sometimes just because I go to meetups and meet up with new people and they're like hey, you talked about short term rentals and medium term rentals and that was cool. Like, hey, do you want to run something for me? Because I don't have any interest in doing it, but I see the value there. I'm like here, let's talk, right. I'm sure that's similar for you guys when you go meet people. Again, it opens up opportunity. And here's the cool part Something that may work for me may not work for you guys. That may work you guys, or may not work for you guys may work for me, right. And so, more than that stuff and having those connections, I know, hey, look, this won't work for me, but I can go talk to Ahmed and Ebraim and get you guys this deal or vice versa, which is really cool.
Speaker 3:There's so many people that feel like they have to be crazy competitive too, right, and there's, there's something to that, right. And so I got. Some people are probably be like, oh gosh, this guy doesn't even know what he's talking about. He's talking about don't be competitive. But at the same time, again, if our goal is to help as many people as possible and we all, at the end of the day, yeah, we want to make money, right, if making money is your own goal, you're not going to make it.
Speaker 3:You look at some of the biggest companies in the world, right? One of my favorites is you look at Apple. They built who they are, based on what they believe they could be and what they could bring to society. They never went in with the intention of, hey, I want to go into this to make just money, right? Steve Jobs I think people kind of underrate him, and Bill Gates is another one of those with Microsoft, and it's kind of funny if you look at when Microsoft did their worst is when Bill Gates stepped down and the other guy came and I remember his name off the top of my head and he stepped into his place and then he was like we're going to make our profit or shareholders rich, right? And then they fell apart because that wasn't what Bill Gates's dream was. His dream was to put, you see, in every single person's home, and that meant he wanted to make it affordable for everybody to use a computer, which is an awesome dream, right? So, again, that's where I go back to starting with the.
Speaker 3:Why is so important, right? Why are you actually doing what you're doing? There's another book called the infinite game, right? If you're competing with everybody else, well, eventually that means somebody's got to be a winner and somebody's going to be a loser. If you become the winner, somebody else lost and guess what? That's not too far behind when somebody's going to beat you out. That's just how it works, right? Nobody can be on top forever and, with that said, if that happens and you made it that specific you're going to go out and it's not going to work well for you. The goal is you want to stay in the game long term because that's how you generate wealth, right? That's how you build relationships. That's how you keep growing, right. So, when we're talking about 2024, building connections is the best thing that you can absolutely do with other people in the real estate world and also with the people that you want to win, too. Right, we're doing what you guys are doing, right? You're a host at a podcast, which is awesome. Right, to teach people about what we do in real estate, why it's so cool. Right, and helping people be in the know of what's actually happening.
Speaker 3:I mean, you look at Andy and again, I'm bullish on Andy. I love Andy because we have a brand new hospital going up. It's a level one trauma hospital downtown Andy and it's Methodist Hospital with IU Health phenomenal hospital. All right, I've actually worked there and it's a great place. On the other side you have Elevance. Who's BlueCraft, blue Shield that's coming to Andy. Right, they're already here, but they're building a global headquarters in Andy, which is awesome, right, andy 11, who are building this huge facility right the big soccer field and they're going to build a big complex around that.
Speaker 3:And people are like, oh, it's just the India 11. I don't think people realize we are one of the number one cities in the United States of America that hosts high school and collegiate games. We'll get that sink in for a second Indianapolis. We are one of the sports mechas in the United States just because we host high school and college, right, and guess what? If people are paying for their kids to be in a travel team in high school, they're bringing money with them. So they're going to want to find a nice place to stay and again, you throw your couch up. It's probably not going to be the place that gets rented, right, they're going to want to stay in a place that's really well designed and a lot of effort as an end, with professional photos. Right, they're spending thousands of dollars to give the play in a league and thousands of dollars to travel everywhere. Well, they're going to pay thousands of dollars to stay in a nice place. You better believe it, right? So those are super important things.
Speaker 3:And again, we're continuing to grow. We have, I know Eli Lilly is looking to expand up into Lebanon, right, which is huge. Eli Lilly is the largest pharmaceutical company in the world I think Don't call me on that one, but they're one of the top right. And then again, look at Allison Viltransmission, one of the best providers for transmissions in the United States, and they're here in India as well, right? And I could keep going on with that list. There's so many awesome companies here and more companies are coming because they see what India is having to offer.
Speaker 3:Right, there's a reason our real estate market has gone up and it's because people are starting to see India is a pretty stinking cool place. There's a lot of things to do. I mean, obviously I'm a cold staying through and through, so we bleed the blue here and Pacers fan, we got several sports teams and there's just so much to offer here in India and I love it. So I think we're a great market and there's a lot to be had in 2024, but you got to set those systems up and set yourself up for success. Absolutely, Thank you.
Speaker 1:Thank you for that. So, if I can go over what you just talked about, airbnb isn't a terrible idea, but you have to be competitive, you have to put enough amenities, you have to connect with people and get your listing out there as much as possible, like you can list it everywhere. If you have that chance, just keep striving and keep connecting with people. We go to seminars or like a link up where you can meet people, let people know what you're doing and all that. These are great ideas, but what people I don't know. But I cannot connect with people. And where would you advise people to start? I mean, we know we have this daily nine to five or like eight to four go to and by the time they got home she already tired and all that stuff. So, before we wrap up, what do you think the little, little effort that people can put in daily or maybe every other day, that will set them off for these? Go, like you know, maybe reach out to people or that stuff. Yeah, right, yeah.
Speaker 3:So some of the big things that people can do and take action steps is learn about it Right, that's how I started, that's how most people have started to, and when you go above and beyond to learn, I think that's super, super helpful. If you're like, hey, you know what, I just don't have the time. Well, let's see what you do have. What are you good at? What are your resources? Maybe you have money Right. Well, maybe pair up with somebody who has time Right and then go forward with there. I know both of us right, is we co-host, right? So maybe those people connect with us and say, hey, look, I got the money We'll pay you to design and run the business and then we'll just set every or we'll pay for it Right, and you do your stuff Right. That's a great option. Right, call of Hamed and say, hey, man, look, I really want to do this, but I'm not sure if I really get got the time Right. Well, we're doing it already. So sometimes that's the easiest way to get in there and guess what, just by being in the same room as people who are already doing it. You're going to learn along the way and guess what Sometimes. Sometimes you look at that and you're like, yeah, maybe maybe I do want to run it on my own. Right, and so you can always look and again set up your systems Right. When you plan those out, sign contracts, do everything the right way, because then if you do decide to change your mind, be interactive and be upfront with people too. Like if somebody comes to me and says, hey, kurt, look, I want to learn, I don't really have time, but I got the money and I want to set up a property, I'll be like, cool, all right, let me grab my team, let's go find a property, whether we want to arbitrage or we want to go in and we want to buy a place, right. And I say, maybe maybe we go 50-50. Right, maybe maybe we go 75-25. It completely depends on the deal. Right, but it depends on what people are willing to do outside of their comfort zone too Right.
Speaker 3:If you're not super trusting in yourself, okay, maybe that is reaching out to somebody who's already doing it and just ask Right, I love the model and I do this all the time. It's funny, my business partner kind of makes fun of me for this sometimes, because she's like you literally just go talk to anybody and like they're just ready to go, and you, just because I don't care if it's a negative interaction, because I'm going to treat them with love and care anyways, because that's just how I am Right. So I will literally just reach out to people on Airbnb or you name it, and I'll just say, hey, I love your property. Would you be mind sharing anything with me? Right, and most people are willing to do that One, because we, as humans, we like to brag a little bit. We're like well, thank you for that compliment. Absolutely, I'll share you my my deep as darkest secrets about how I run this world. Right, and we love that.
Speaker 3:And here's the thing we also like to teach. I love education, I love teaching. So when people come to me and ask questions, that's awesome, because when I teach it, that means I'm continuing to learn and it also means I can do things that maybe I've made a mistake on that. You don't want to go and do the same thing, right, and by doing that again, we talked about this earlier. But that doesn't necessarily mean that we expect something back from those people. Guess what If we teach somebody something and then they go on to do crazy things? Guess what?
Speaker 3:Maybe on the road, they come back and say, hey, kurt, you know what you stepped up to the plate, you helped me into this, and you know what I'm so grateful for that. Hey, I got money. I want to invest with you now, right For hey, I got this property, I found this great deal, and I was thinking of you because, again, I was so grateful for what you did for me earlier in my life. Are you interested in this, right? And yet that may be 40 years from the road down the road. It may never happen, but it can happen Again. Help people before you get help, and then it'll come around eventually in one way, shape or form. And people are always watching too, right? Just looking at the next person, somebody's watching that, even if that person doesn't come back to you, somebody else is going to see that you helped that person and it's in the compact. All right, trust me on that one man. I'm a big fan of giving back in every way, shape or form that we can, and it's important.
Speaker 2:So absolutely Thank you for sharing that and we really appreciate it. So one thing that I picked up why you are addressing the 2024 in the market is a lot of potential. You just have to, like you said, connect with the right people that can get you in the room of people that are actually doing this thing, talking about it, have some little, little secrets they can share and, before you know it, you will be able to reach back down and help other people. I remember when I started yesterday, so it's really important to connect, like we always say, connect with people that are doing it, that can actually get you up there. And if you call me, I mean, what kind of mattress can I buy for my room?
Speaker 2:I'm not going to charge you for that.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 2:It's just simple question. Get around people and ask the right question. So my final question we still go back to 2024. If you are to, let's say, advise me starting off like now I'm just joining your mentorship and I'm going into 2024 and I get ready to go what would be the first strategy that you will ask me to consider?
Speaker 3:First thing, I'm going to tell you to read the book. Start with why. Second thing, I'm going to tell you to read the book Atomic Habits. Third thing, I'm going to tell you, once you've figured out what your Y is, that's going to determine what exit strategy you're going to target whether it's short-term rental, whether it's medium-term rental, whether it's co-living, whether it's long-term rental, whether it's multifamily, whether it's arbitrage it could be any of those. You have to also then weigh out the risk. If you don't want a lot of risk, well then I'm probably going to point you towards a long-term rental game, which right now are really hard to pencil. If you're like you know what, I've got the capital, I'm ready to go. I've learned a lot. I feel confident in this. I'm going to say, hey look, doing a short-term rental is a good option. You just have to be diligent about what you're doing. I love personally, one of my favorite things is a hybrid model where during the summers especially in Indy, with all the stuff that happens here you run it as a short-term rental, and then over the winter, you run it as a medium-term rental, and when you do stuff like that, that's a nice little payout because you can again get those higher rates for those time? Because again we have the Indianapolis 500. Literally the largest race in the world, largest sporting event in the world, actually 300,000 plus people in one place in Speedway Indiana, right Just west of downtown Indy. And actually that's not even the number one rental for Indianapolis. The number one thing that brings people to Indianapolis, that brings revenue to Indy, is actually Comic Con. So again, if you rent out during those times and then in the meantime set up those connections to other people to get into hospitals, getting into nursing groups, any of those, now you've got a business that is modeled around getting multiple streams going right. Then you're getting more connections, right. And guess what, let's say, a travel nurse calls you in the middle of that time. You're like, oh gosh, I don't have a spot for him. Well, reach out to one of us and say, hey, guess what, I got a spot open and guess what We'll pay you for that. We'll say, hey, thank you for sending us that person. And guess what, here's a little fee of a thank you for getting us them to us. And so it's another way to make a little extra cash on the side, right, and I'm a firm believer in that, because then it fills up my place, your place is already filled up, and then again we can continue to go forward. So that's all about helping people, right?
Speaker 3:So I think, if you want to be as cautious as possible, right, long-term rentals is the way to go, right. That's the easiest way. If you can run the numbers and make that work, it you know what. That's the way to go. If you want to make the most money, short-term rentals are the way to go, but there's a lot more risk involved and there's a lot more work involved too, especially if you self-manage which, again, if you build systems, it's really not that bad right. I manage my property in Kentucky from here and I spend a total of maybe, I would say on a really busy week and hour at the most. That's it, right. Other than that, don't touch it because I forgot my system set up. Right.
Speaker 3:Medium-term rental takes a lot of work, specifically because you're building relationships. Right. You're calling people all the time to try to build those relationships, to have lead coming to you to say, hey, I need a property to stay in, I need a property to stay in, I need a property to stay in, right. So, again, there's a lot of diligence in any of these long-term rentals, you still have to at least post it, right. But if you're going to get in the medium-term and short-term game, you got to be ready to work. You got to be ready to grind a little bit. It is not going to be a. I'm going to post it and people are just going to come. You'll get some, right, what's the phrase? Even a blind squirrel can find a nut every once in a while. Right, You'll get some.
Speaker 3:But if you want to be the top tier, you got to put effort into it. And again, prepare as if Airbnb is going out of business, right, if you prepare like that, then if they do, or if they change all of their stuff, let's say they again. Everybody is like, oh, it's so great, I just throw it on there. But let's say they start charging 20% right, for an OTA fee, which is very possible. All of a sudden, your numbers don't work, right. And then that's not including, maybe, paying for a property manager or a co-host, right, that's just paying for the listing. So you got to find multiple models at work. And again, if you build out your own business, that's going to be a really important way to do it.
Speaker 1:Sheet Fantastic. Yeah, that's a good one. We really appreciate all the knowledge you've been pouring out and definitely I've learned from it. Good, yeah, I'm going to come up with the stuff you strategists that you've explained in details to us. I want to thank you for coming here today. I mean it's really an honor for you. We thought about a week or two weeks ago I mean, the belly is short notice, but the fact that you created the time, we really appreciate that and I'm sure our audience, they, also appreciate this. Thank you, thank you, thank you, ahmed. What do you say? Because court is very, very interesting person. I mean, the first time I met you, you are just real like this. Do you like it? I can tell that you like to connect people together. So I see that energy in you and someone like you, this guy is already the limit. That's the fact, even if you're not even, let's say, you just want to start today.
Speaker 1:The kind of energy you have, it's going to attract that goodwill, attract people to you. So keep it up, ahmed, go ahead.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I want to thank you for coming. We really appreciate this. I'm 100% sure that our audience they love this as well. But before we let you go, we would like to know. You mentioned something about helping people to invest earlier on. Can you tell us a little bit about CC Home and the bond voyage rental? What do you do and how people reach you?
Speaker 3:So CC Homes, what it is is essentially we bring on people, and we will say this way we take on capital investors, so people who want to bring money to a deal but don't necessarily want to go and specifically invest themselves and do the work right. They just want to collect the check at the end of the day and let other people manage it and let them find the deal. They don't want to do any of that stuff and with our group, essentially you can invest to then sit back, relax and let us take care of it, and you still get a payout for it, which is really nice. So you can always reach us. So my Instagram is Curtisbonner. It's K-U-R-T-I-S. Dot bonner, b-o-n-n-e-r. You can definitely reach me there.
Speaker 3:Now I'm not as on top of it like you guys are with your Instagram. I'm gonna have to step up my game. Maybe we'll start another podcast too. I don't know. We'll see how wild I'm feeling, but you can reach out to me there. You can also find me on Facebook.
Speaker 3:Those places for CC Homes, for bond voyage rentals and for SE properties. What we do is co-hosting, so people that maybe have a property to us as well, and if they reach out to us again same way as that K-U-R-T-I-S dot B-O-N-N-E-R on Instagram. If you reach out to me through there, you can ask me to look into co-hosting and again, the way I do it as I set up, we'll go in and we'll design it, you'll and we'll do the rest right, and that way you can get some of that real estate feeling right. You get all the same benefits of real estate, but maybe you just want to learn it a little bit and you do use that as a way to learn it. So it's a great option, I think, but also to kind of learn along the process.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, absolutely. Thank you for sharing. We've come to the top of our here. Can they do that, and what kind of service can they reach you? Thank you, yeah, thank you so much.
Speaker 1:It's very easy. I mean, just go to IB routers on Instagram. You can DM me, anything. Dm me where you can call my number three, one, seven, seven, two, eight, zero, two, one, three. I'm a router, some public person, so I just go ahead. They contact me. I made it to your time. How can people reach out to you and what do you do?
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely Everything in real estate off market deals, credit financing, if you have a property that you want us to manage. I have a business, a seal property, that manage property. We literally just started, but we have like four properties under our bed already. So the coolest thing that you get from HOS is that you get a personalized experience. You get to I don't want to say be in the driver's seat, because I don't want to put out a false information but we have the confidence that the person running it for you is actually the vision aligned with yours. So that is what we do.
Speaker 2:We have a lot of people reaching out to us and thanking us for the type of services that we provide. So if you made a management service, please reach out to HOS. My Instagram is the easiest, which is the official middle of all, or you can also call my business line, 762-240-793-2. All right, thank you guys. It's been an honor to learn joy, everything that you share with us. I learned a lot. If I can say that I learned a lot, imagine how much our audience learned from you. So thank you for your time. We really, really appreciate it.